Joseph Mallozzi Blog - Discussion, ***Major Spoilers for all seasons, please use Caution*** Rating Options

[LadySciFi]

Alyjude also writes: “But maybe SGU is costing more than expected? *arched eyebrow* No money left for the movie?”

Answer: Alas, it doesn’t work that way. There’s no communal Stargate pot from which the various productions draw from. Each budget is approved on a project by project basis.

Maybe I am wrong but wan't there a comment made that there was a choice that the studio gave TPTB between SGA or starting SGU and they chose SGU, or was that one of our assumptions?

[Cimmer]

Maybe I am wrong but wan't there a comment made that there was a choice that the studio gave TPTB between SGA or starting SGU and they chose SGU, or was that one of our assumptions?

No there was such a comment but it was AFTER some of the comments of TPTB were brought into question so it's hard to say whether it was a 'well thought out' comment. Remember back at the beginning of all this the movie was greenlit too and then it wasn't. We may have been getting 'answers' that were designed to make the pesky fans go away.

I suppose it would depend on the contract. Each project might have it's own separate budget, it's true but one would think the producers have to ante up something, that's the main function of a production company after all,providing at least some of the cash so I guess it would depend on the agreement between Syfy, MGM and TPTB. I would think it would have been BW and Co. who hired JM and MG to write the script for the movie because they stated they would develop a movie for Syfy. I wonder who has the arm twisting capability here? I'm guessing the production company would have some power especially if their latest product is bringing in the bucks, which it hasn't yet. If it doesn't bring in the cash then their 'power' to get their way would decline as well I would guess. You're only as good as your last project sort of thing?

[SylvreWolfe]

Maybe I am wrong but wan't there a comment made that there was a choice that the studio gave TPTB between SGA or starting SGU and they chose SGU, or was that one of our assumptions?

Brad Wright actually said something like that in an interview a good season before SGA was canceled. He said they wanted him to do both series and he got his widdle ego hurt and stomped his feet and said he wanted just the one series and movies.

[Cimmer]

Brad Wright actually said something like that in an interview a good season before SGA was canceled. He said they wanted him to do both series and he got his widdle ego hurt and stomped his feet and said he wanted just the one series and movies.

I wonder if Syfy will change the way it deals with producers after all this. They seem to dance to the tune of others; Caprica, SGU, must be annoying.

[bheadher]

No there was such a comment but it was AFTER some of the comments of TPTB were brought into question so it's hard to say whether it was a 'well thought out' comment. Remember back at the beginning of all this the movie was greenlit too and then it wasn't. We may have been getting 'answers' that were designed to make the pesky fans go away.

I suppose it would depend on the contract. Each project might have it's own separate budget, it's true but one would think the producers have to ante up something, that's the main function of a production company after all,providing at least some of the cash so I guess it would depend on the agreement between Syfy, MGM and TPTB. I would think it would have been BW and Co. who hired JM and MG to write the script for the movie because they stated they would develop a movie for Syfy. I wonder who has the arm twisting capability here? I'm guessing the production company would have some power especially if their latest product is bringing in the bucks, which it hasn't yet. If it doesn't bring in the cash then their 'power' to get their way would decline as well I would guess. You're only as good as your last project sort of thing?

I also don't think there was ever a plain language admission that SGU was "chosen" over SGA. I'll try to reconstruct a kind of sequence of the type of comments/explanations that took place. This is a very rough approximation of the timeline:

Phase one: "It wasn't us, it was MGM that didn't want to continue...we wanted to, they said no"

Phase two: "Well, it was actually a collective decision. The studio and producers got together with MGM and we all agreed it would be best to end SGA on a "High note"...besides, it is just too hard to do two projects at once." *Note* This seems to be an "allusion" to their being a choice between the two, but the comments were never issued at the same time, or in direct relation to the two shows.

Phase three: "Well, we really wanted to draw in a newer demographic, the "old guard" just wasn't cutting it. **Note* This is when the you know what hit the proverbial fan...in shorthand, "loyal fan base go "HUH, what you mean paleface?" TPTB go, "Oh come on, all you old decrepit viewers are ignorant. You'll watch whatever we put out. We want 'younger' fans, THEY got moola to spare!"

Phase four: "Ummm, btw guys...SGU gonna be darker, grittier and closer to the way humans act. Look at BSG, they drew in young viewers AND women, we can do same. SciFi liked BSG very muchly, wants all new shows to be like like. Ohh, btw...SciFi sounds soo old, they gonna jaz up the name and become SyFy, so much cooler, dontcha think?"

...you get the idea of course. If anybody wants to correct, chastise, or add to history, feel free. The quotations certainly aren't accurate, more of a "my impression" type thing...but I think the progression depicts what happened.

p.s. I do remember JM saying several times that each series is funded separately, as different projects...

[Cimmer]

I also don't think there was ever a plain language admission that SGU was "chosen" over SGA. I'll try to reconstruct a kind of sequence of the type of comments/explanations that took place. This is a very rough approximation of the timeline:

Phase one: "It wasn't us, it was MGM that didn't want to continue...we wanted to, they said no"

Phase two: "Well, it was actually a collective decision. The studio and producers got together with MGM and we all agreed it would be best to end SGA on a "High note"...besides, it is just too hard to do two projects at once." *Note* This seems to be an "allusion" to their being a choice between the two, but the comments were never issued at the same time, or in direct relation to the two shows.

Phase three: "Well, we really wanted to draw in a newer demographic, the "old guard" just wasn't cutting it. **Note* This is when the you know what hit the proverbial fan...in shorthand, "loyal fan base go "HUH, what you mean paleface?" TPTB go, "Oh come on, all you old decrepit viewers are ignorant. You'll watch whatever we put out. We want 'younger' fans, THEY got moola to spare!"

Phase four: "Ummm, btw guys...SGU gonna be darker, grittier and closer to the way humans act. Look at BSG, they drew in young viewers AND women, we can do same. SciFi liked BSG very muchly, wants all new shows to be like like. Ohh, btw...SciFi sounds soo old, they gonna jaz up the name and become SyFy, so much cooler, dontcha think?"

...you get the idea of course. If anybody wants to correct, chastise, or add to history, feel free. The quotations certainly aren't accurate, more of a "my impression" type thing...but I think the progression depicts what happened.

p.s. I do remember JM saying several times that each series is funded separately, as different projects...

That makes sense that each project is funded separately and exists as their own "LLC's" (sorta). It protects them in the event of bankruptcy or suits and the loans can be made to each individual entity if they get loans. However, the 'secured' funds do have to come from somewhere and it's usually the individuals of the company that put up the 'collateral' so perhaps they didn't want to or were unable to secure two projects at once? It may be that they also can't 'secure' a movie and a series at this time due to the economic climate and if the studio and network don't want to take the risk either?

Oh well, you can't argue if someone says they don't have the cash and can't get it. Although it's a good argument for finding someone else to bankroll the project, yes?? Hope springs eternal!

[squall28]

Ok so the budget for the movies is different than the budget for SGU and don't come from the same pot. But what is the difference if MGM chooses to go ahead with a budget for SGU and not the movies? Isn't it sorta the same thing? They use the bad economy excuse and yet SGU will have this huge budget.

[bheadher]

Ok so the budget for the movies is different than the budget for SGU and don't come from the same pot. But what is the difference if MGM chooses to go ahead with a budget for SGU and not the movies? Isn't it sorta the same thing? They use the bad economy excuse and yet SGU will have this huge budget.

That's the part we aren't suppose to notice Squall...ever...

[Cimmer]

Ok so the budget for the movies is different than the budget for SGU and don't come from the same pot. But what is the difference if MGM chooses to go ahead with a budget for SGU and not the movies? Isn't it sorta the same thing? They use the bad economy excuse and yet SGU will have this huge budget.

Well the budget being separate only really applies to the production company, not MGM. A different department may oversee the DVD's but Stargate should have someone like Cohen who okays what goes on with that franchise. What it comes down to is who is putting up the money for the movie? Is it totally MGM? Is some of it coming from Syfy? Does some of it have to come from BW's production company? Is there agreement with each other such that one can't move ahead without the okay of the others and is there a drop dead date in the contract(s) where if a movie isn't made by a certain date then rights revert back to MGM?

I would be really surprised if MGM had signed a development deal with Wright and Co. that was open ended and put the future of the franchise entirely in their hands with the power to decided whether to do the movie or not on their own timeline. They probably have X amount of months or years to develop the project or movies. That's how real estate developers work. If the project doesn't move ahead or options aren't exercised within a certain time frame it reverts back to the original owner or the property or the deal is termed dead and has to be renegotiated.

I have no idea why MGM is putting so much extra money into SGU. Of course this extra money could be ONLY for a certain amount of time and then the tap is off. It could be that MGM was willing to use that extra money for SGA and when SGA was ended they said fine, take it for SGU. That would be a slap in the face.

As with most things, if they wanted to do it they would find the money.

[MissingLink]

From JM's 8/30 blog:


Today, it gives me great pleasure to kick off my No Fan Left Behind campaign, a campaign designed to get all Stargate fans – past, present, and future – ready for the big October 2nd world premiere of Stargate: Universe. Whether you’re fans of SG-1, Atlantis, or a complete newbies to the franchise, you’re all welcome aboard Destiny as it prepares for its first manned voyage through distant galaxies fraught with riddles, revelations, action, and adventure


Wowser!!! Just what we've been waiting for! Joe, you and TPTB have already left the loyal SGA fans behind.

[Chucknician]

From JM's 8/30 blog:


Today, it gives me great pleasure to kick off my No Fan Left Behind campaign, a campaign designed to get all Stargate fans – past, present, and future – ready for the big October 2nd world premiere of Stargate: Universe. Whether you’re fans of SG-1, Atlantis, or a complete newbies to the franchise, you’re all welcome aboard Destiny as it prepares for its first manned voyage through distant galaxies fraught with riddles, revelations, action, and adventure


Wowser!!! Just what we've been waiting for! Joe, you and TPTB have already left the loyal SGA fans behind.

that’s made my day it really has, oh my so where were they a year ago then, didn’t need us then did they, call me cynical coz well I know I am BUT do you think they may just be a bit well, how to say this politely a worried that they may have screwed themselves


Also what happens if as a SGA or SG1 fan YOU WANT TO BE LEFT BEHIND, kinda please drop me off at the nearset planet PLEASE an you dont want to go on board the bloody Destiny as it prepares for its first manned voyage through distant galaxies fraught with riddles, revelations, action, and adventure

Oh goody riddles, revelations, action an adventure I'm sitting her chuckling away to myself, an this is NOT going to be a night time version soap opera , yeah right " ha ha"

I thought SGA fans were so few as to not make for finanical success so doesnt it matter you left them behind, or does it

[Cimmer]

From JM's 8/30 blog:


Today, it gives me great pleasure to kick off my No Fan Left Behind campaign, a campaign designed to get all Stargate fans – past, present, and future – ready for the big October 2nd world premiere of Stargate: Universe. Whether you’re fans of SG-1, Atlantis, or a complete newbies to the franchise, you’re all welcome aboard Destiny as it prepares for its first manned voyage through distant galaxies fraught with riddles, revelations, action, and adventure


Wowser!!! Just what we've been waiting for! Joe, you and TPTB have already left the loyal SGA fans behind.

Someone should remind them that there wasn't 'enough of us to make a difference'.

[SylvreWolfe]

From JM's 8/30 blog:


Today, it gives me great pleasure to kick off my No Fan Left Behind campaign, a campaign designed to get all Stargate fans – past, present, and future – ready for the big October 2nd world premiere of Stargate: Universe. Whether you’re fans of SG-1, Atlantis, or a complete newbies to the franchise, you’re all welcome aboard Destiny as it prepares for its first manned voyage through distant galaxies fraught with riddles, revelations, action, and adventure


Wowser!!! Just what we've been waiting for! Joe, you and TPTB have already left the loyal SGA fans behind.

Oooh *happy claps, happy claps*, will there be popcorn??

[bheadher]

Ladies ladies, do I detect a tiny amount of sarcasm here...

[SylvreWolfe]

Ladies ladies, do I detect a tiny amount of sarcasm here...

Tiny? That describes something that belongs to Joe M and Hardly Wright.

[squall28]

Someone should remind them that there wasn't 'enough of us to make a difference'.

I know this is generalizing but if you talk to the BSG fans here, they don't seem to have any interest in SGU, even if it may be similar to BSG. So the fans were not enough to keep SGA and SG-1 afloat but yet they are counting on them to keep SGU? It doesn't make sense.

[Cimmer]

I know this is generalizing but if you talk to the BSG fans here, they don't seem to have any interest in SGU, even if it may be similar to BSG. So the fans were not enough to keep SGA and SG-1 afloat but yet they are counting on them to keep SGU? It doesn't make sense.

I don't know Squall. I know you have to have boundless optimism and a thick skin to work in the entertainment industry so maybe they're just figuring that SGU is so darn good that it'll pull in fans from all over the place. Me, I believe in karma and it's never been that TPTB desired to make another Stargate that annoyed me or even that they wanted to do one that was 'different', it was always the attitude; towards the SGA fans and the actors and just anyone that questioned the decision. It was graceless and shady, IMO and I think a lot of people would have been much more accepting of the coming show if things had been handled in a better manner. Perhaps TPTB believe that viewers could care less as long as they have something to watch (it's certainly a valid observation considering past examples) but it's just as true that sometimes things turn around and bite you in the a** when you least expect it. I would think, starting a new venture, that one would try and secure as many allies as possible; after all it takes little skill to win over friends.

Moshe Dayan:

If you want to make peace, you don't talk to your friends. You talk to your enemies.

Of course this thought applies as well:

Woodrow Wilson:

If you want to make enemies, try to change something.

[squall28]

It's like with Warehouse13. I did not expect much from the show. I love the show now, and it is ripping the ratings charts! It was a show to entertain people. SGU on the other hand as so much to live up to. We expect something worthy of replacing SGA and I know a lot of fans want the show to keep the Stargate element alive, and that has been in question. So the karma seems a little shakey. I hope that we are wrong and the show is great.

[Cimmer]

It's like with Warehouse13. I did not expect much from the show. I love the show now, and it is ripping the ratings charts! It was a show to entertain people. SGU on the other hand as so much to live up to. We expect something worthy of replacing SGA and I know a lot of fans want the show to keep the Stargate element alive, and that has been in question. So the karma seems a little shakey. I hope that we are wrong and the show is great.

I'm not the W13 fan you are but it's okay. I expect, probably due to my work, that I'm uncomfortably like the Network suits who are advertising W13 as 'Syfy's best kept secret', in other words, they wanted more than what they have. I think SGU will suffer from the same problem. We're thinking small potatoes; (the ratings of W13 are excellent, for Syfy, but compared to The Closer and Burn Notice etc, not so hot.) Syfy is down there with Hallmark in the overall ratings and what was good enough for the past 17 years will no longer do. That's why they're advertising the h*ll out of W13 and putting a million more an ep into SGU. The shows can no longer be okay, for Syfy, they have to be okay for TNT and USA and Disney etc. You can't get a Cheerios or a Subaru or a Lexus account on okay for Syfy. This is their big push and unfortunately by the luck of the draw, the economy took a nose dive, but once the plans are set in motion, corporate moves are much like war plans, they can't be put off or changed once the pieces are in place. It reminds me of that Woody Allen quote in Annie Hall:

A relationship, I think, is like a shark. You know? It has to constantly move forward or it dies. And I think what we got on our hands is a dead shark.

Syfy is worried about having a dead shark on their hands.

[MissingLink]

JM's 8/31 blog:


Joe continues touting his fabulous 'NO FAN LEFT BEHIND' program. (Sorry, Joe, you've lost me.)

For all of the gory details, and some SGA pics, go here: http://josephmallozzi.wordpress.com/