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Why are Sci Fi (Now Syfy) Movies bad these days?


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#1 SciFiMenei

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Posted 29 September 2009 - 02:57 PM

I'm a big fan of syfy Movies but I've been every syfi movie I see they always have bad reviews.

Why don't they make them good? Can't they just save up money to make a bigger budget or are the makers of Syfy channel too lazy?

#2 MockingbirdGirl

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Posted 29 September 2009 - 03:07 PM

QUOTE (SciFiMenei @ Sep 29 2009, 02:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I'm a big fan of syfy Movies but I've been every syfi movie I see they always have bad reviews.

Why don't they make them good? Can't they just save up money to make a bigger budget or are the makers of Syfy channel too lazy?

I don't think Syfy cares about the reviews; they have found a successful formula to provide inexpensive yet popular entertainment. From their perspective, it's win-win. And as an added bonus, the money they save can be spent on higher-profile dramatic series, like Warehouse 13, Stargate: Universe and Caprica.

They might not be to my taste, but there's no denying the Syfy original films pull in big ratings. Clearly, there's a segment of the viewing public that's happy with them just the way they are.



#3 SciFiMenei

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Posted 29 September 2009 - 03:14 PM

QUOTE (MockingbirdGirl @ Sep 29 2009, 04:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I don't think Syfy cares about the reviews; they have found a successful formula to provide inexpensive yet popular entertainment. From their perspective, it's win-win. And as an added bonus, the money they save can be spent on higher-profile dramatic series, like Warehouse 13, Stargate: Universe and Caprica.

They might not be to my taste, but there's no denying the Syfy original films pull in big ratings. Clearly, there's a segment of the viewing public that's happy with them just the way they are.


Oh I see.

#4 -Deleted

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Posted 29 September 2009 - 03:36 PM

QUOTE (MockingbirdGirl @ Sep 29 2009, 10:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
They might not be to my taste, but there's no denying the Syfy original films pull in big ratings. Clearly, there's a segment of the viewing public that's happy with them just the way they are.



really ? all that boa vs. python c.r.ap ??

#5 MockingbirdGirl

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Posted 29 September 2009 - 03:54 PM

QUOTE (hellboy70 @ Sep 29 2009, 03:36 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
really ? all that boa vs. python c.r.ap ??

When Boa vs. Python premiered on the Sci-Fi Channel in 2004, it scored a 1.8 Nielsen Rating, making it the highest rated Sci-Fi Channel show for the week.

So, in answer to your question: Yes. One man's trash is another man's treasure.


Edited by MockingbirdGirl, 29 September 2009 - 04:19 PM.


#6 txlucky1

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Posted 29 September 2009 - 04:31 PM

QUOTE (hellboy70 @ Sep 29 2009, 03:36 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
really ? all that boa vs. python c.r.ap ??


I read that the Bulgarian films for Syfy are kept under a 2 million budget but sell advertising for much more. For Boa vs Python, the production costs were around $1,200,000 but advertising and DVD sales have already topped 5 million. I'd say that is a nice profit.

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#7 soundping

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Posted 29 September 2009 - 05:30 PM

I don't why they can't make Saturdays "Classic Science Fiction Day" and run classic Sci-Fi movies? Maybe run some old drive-in Sci-Fi movies. smile.gif

#8 GalacticaBulldog

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Posted 29 September 2009 - 05:57 PM

Because a) not enough people want to see those. Fans of those films have already seen them many times and often have copies. And fans of science fiction and horror and fantasy in general mainly want to see newer movies that they haven't seen before. That's the main reason SciFi was not particularly successful in its early years - it only ran old B+W features that only a few hundred thousand people ever tuned in to see,

and b ) if they did that, guess what would happen? Half a dozen mansquito posters would still log in to claim that they have been viewers since day one but have never posted before, and why are YOU insulting all the fans by running all this low-budget black-and-white cer-rapola? YOU should fire all the suits and listen to what the fans want.

#9 MockingbirdGirl

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Posted 29 September 2009 - 06:04 PM

Also, Syfy can't just show whatever it feels like -- it needs to own the rights to broadcast those films. So, for example, anything that shows up on Turner Classic Movies is automatically off the table.



#10 PissedofVulcan

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Posted 29 September 2009 - 06:15 PM

I always thought that Skiffy should simulcast coast to coast am and put cameras in the studio.

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#11 soundping

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Posted 29 September 2009 - 06:37 PM

QUOTE (PissedofVulcan @ Sep 29 2009, 07:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I always thought that Skiffy should simulcast coast to coast am and put cameras in the studio.

Coast to Coast AM is the only reason I listen to radio now.

#12 PissedofVulcan

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Posted 29 September 2009 - 08:03 PM

QUOTE (soundping @ Sep 29 2009, 06:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Coast to Coast AM is the only reason I listen to radio now.

I only get to listen to it once in a while when I get to go into work early. I have been listening to it since Art Bell days.

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#13 easygordon

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Posted 29 September 2009 - 08:10 PM

QUOTE (SciFiMenei @ Sep 29 2009, 03:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I'm a big fan of syfy Movies but I've been every syfi movie I see they always have bad reviews.

Why don't they make them good? Can't they just save up money to make a bigger budget or are the makers of Syfy channel too lazy?

I'm willing to bet there are a ton of good scripts out there and plenty of filmmakers who would love to have a $2 million budget to realize them. Low budget does not have to mean schlock. Look what Joss Whedon did with Dr. Horrible with just $200,000.




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#14 demonxanth

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 10:33 AM

QUOTE (easygordon @ Sep 29 2009, 08:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I'm willing to bet there are a ton of good scripts out there and plenty of filmmakers who would love to have a $2 million budget to realize them. Low budget does not have to mean schlock. Look what Joss Whedon did with Dr. Horrible with just $200,000.

There absolutely are. Those are the ones being made. Dr. Horrible is the perfect example - it sold lots of copies, it won awards... and 99.99% of the people who supported it did so in silence (as opposed to announcing somewhere in public that they liked it.) But go to any message board online, and you will find dozens of anonymous people complaining about how bad it was. Not hundreds...not thousands...not tens of thousands... just dozens. (With no proof that they actually ever saw it.) But ask random people at a supermarket what they thought of it, and few if any will ever have heard of it.

It's the same with the original movies. The poster above suggests that "classic" drive-in sci-fi movies should be shown, because they would somehow be better. And yet when those originally came out, the overwhelming bulk of humanity thought they were schlock. And still do. And supposedly "quality" movies fare no better: go ask a random old lady in the supermarket which she thinks is better, the original Solaris, or Blade Runner, and she'll assume you're a freak and a loser if you even watch science ficton, let alone remember titles of movies.

The original poster unintentionally points out the basic problem, thinking that if they spent more money, then the movies would somehow be "better." Which is the prevalent mode of thinking nowadays - Transformers and GI Joe spent plenty of money on cgi, and months of shooting and re-shooting the same scenes and individual takes, so that they could edit in the best out of 50 tries. So those must be "good." A lower budget movie only has time to shoot a couple of takes of everything, and may want to go ahead and depict full-on effects shots (rather than glimpses and shadows) and not worry about whether or not it's realistic. (Since... ummm... how realistic can projected images on a flat screen in your living room be anyway?) And so the lower budget movie is called schlock. Not by any people who act in movies...or produce movies... or write movies... just by people who watch movies, and get deceived into thinking more money means "better."

It's been said repeatedly before: if Brad and Angelina were the stars of Boa vs. Python, and Michael Bay splurged $200 million on it, fanboys online would say it was the greatest movie ever. But if Sir Ben Kingsley had been the star of Blade Runner, and Ridely Scott directed under an alias, and it were done for $2 million and aired as an original... 2 million people would still watch, but half a dozen people would complain online about its quality, and how no-name directors and washed up actors made these films an insult to all the fans.

#15 LordStarFyre1

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 10:44 AM

QUOTE (easygordon @ Sep 29 2009, 08:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I'm willing to bet there are a ton of good scripts out there and plenty of filmmakers who would love to have a $2 million budget to realize them. Low budget does not have to mean schlock. Look what Joss Whedon did with Dr. Horrible with just $200,000.


Someone should suggest to the management at Skiffy that rather than a name change, which was simply a stupid attempt to distance themselves from SciFi, that maybe, just maybe, they should really introduce themselves to SciFi.

Mega Shark versus Mega Octopus isn't SciFi.

I mean, I can call a Cat a Dog, but I have no business trying to teach the poor thing how to bark.

Here's some suggestions Skiffy, why not look up some of these things, and make some movies based on these, rather than the shlocky Monster/Horror Movies...

http://www.coverbrow...nding-stories/7

Just a thought

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#16 demonxanth

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 11:23 AM

QUOTE (LordStarFyre1 @ Sep 30 2009, 11:44 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Someone should suggest to the management at Skiffy that rather than a name change, which was simply a stupid attempt to distance themselves from SciFi, that maybe, just maybe, they should really introduce themselves to SciFi.

Mega Shark versus Mega Octopus isn't SciFi.


But if two management people feel it is, wouldn't you then lose 2 to 1? Or would you lose 2 to 0? Who knows better what they should do? Someone is is capable of getting a job there, or someone who isn't?

I think it might help if you could produce some hard core data that proves definitively that they would attract more viewers who would be entertained more by following the suggestions of an anonymous stranger.

QUOTE (LordStarFyre1 @ Sep 30 2009, 11:44 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Here's some suggestions Skiffy, why not look up some of these things, and make some movies based on these, rather than the shlocky Monster/Horror Movies...


Wouldn't it make more sense to send these suggestions to the network itself, rather than announcing them to other viewers?

Although realistically - in the last, say, 100 years of film making, is there any documentation of any studio or network or producer investing million of dollars based on an anonymous suggestion? And again - is there some credible, conclusive evidence that more viewers would be satisfied by following any of these suggestions? Since there is extensive evidence that more and more satisfied viewers are being atracted tom the network by doing exactly what they're already doing.

So not saying that you're wrong... but do you have any tangible data to support that you're right?



#17 LordStarFyre1

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 11:57 AM

QUOTE (demonxanth @ Sep 30 2009, 12:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
But if two management people feel it is, wouldn't you then lose 2 to 1? Or would you lose 2 to 0? Who knows better what they should do? Someone is is capable of getting a job there, or someone who isn't?

I think it might help if you could produce some hard core data that proves definitively that they would attract more viewers who would be entertained more by following the suggestions of an anonymous stranger.



Wouldn't it make more sense to send these suggestions to the network itself, rather than announcing them to other viewers?

Although realistically - in the last, say, 100 years of film making, is there any documentation of any studio or network or producer investing million of dollars based on an anonymous suggestion? And again - is there some credible, conclusive evidence that more viewers would be satisfied by following any of these suggestions? Since there is extensive evidence that more and more satisfied viewers are being atracted tom the network by doing exactly what they're already doing.

So not saying that you're wrong... but do you have any tangible data to support that you're right?


Tangible Data?

Mega Shark Versus Mega Octopus, Ice Spiders, Boa vs. Python.

Are ANY of those "SciFi?

What is the name of the network?

Get the idea?

Face it, you want tangibles, with something like SciFi. However, so far it appears that "SyFy" has taken to the idea that cheap Horror movies are defacto SciFi. Yes, I mention it here, because I'd like to discuss it.

Now, I get that you're not likeing the idea that I post these concepts in public, and would rather they be sent, in secret, to Syfy, where they would be promply placed into the shredder, er, suggestion box. I get that. It's all good.

So I'll sit here and happily watch the next Syfy Classic "Killer Hampster Versus Monster Gerbil" because you think it's better to be quiet and take it, rather than mention that the Emperor's shvantz is swinging in the breeze.

Gee, why even have Public forums?

Seriously, what do the peons know. I mean really. Because the Execs at Syfy got their jobs, that means they, by default, know way more about SciFi than us mere mortals.

Funny, I never knew Wrestling was Science Fiction.......

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#18 GoramFrakkingNerfHerder

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 12:22 PM

Science fiction and horror have a common root. Probably the earliest science fiction novel was Frankenstein, which also happened to be a horror novel.

I don't see how Boa Vs. Python isn't Sci-Fi. Unless, of course, you want to argue that anything you don't like isn't Sci-Fi. Granted, I'm not a Godzilla fan myself and don't think those movies involve any complex thought, but they're still science fiction.
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#19 MockingbirdGirl

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 12:30 PM

QUOTE (LordStarFyre1 @ Sep 30 2009, 11:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Tangible Data?

Mega Shark Versus Mega Octopus, Ice Spiders, Boa vs. Python.

Are ANY of those "SciFi?

What is the name of the network?

Well, it's not "The Sci-Fi Channel" any more... so your argument that they should limit themselves to only 'pure' science-fiction fare doesn't really hold water.



#20 demonxanth

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 01:03 PM

QUOTE (LordStarFyre1 @ Sep 30 2009, 12:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Gee, why even have Public forums?


Ah - I have the answer! From the terms of service you agreed to:

QUOTE
Unless otherwise specified, the materials in the Site are presented solely for the purpose of promoting programs, films, products and services available in, and other uses in, the United States, its territories, possessions and protectorates.
......

There are a number of places on the Site where members of the public can post comments or contribute content. We neither endorse nor are responsible for any opinion, advice, information, or statement made or displayed on the Site by third parties.


And from the Feedback feature:

QUOTE
If you have suggestions or comments for our Programming Department about Syfy or any of its shows, please contact:
feedback@syfy.com


So it would appear that "public" forums - in this case, private forums you have to register for, operated by private, for-profit corporations - are solely for the purpose of prmoting the network, by allowing its viewers to discuss things with each other. The way to contact the network is via the Feedback feature.

QUOTE (LordStarFyre1 @ Sep 30 2009, 12:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Now, I get that you're not likeing the idea that I post these concepts in public, and would rather they be sent, in secret, to Syfy, where they would be promply placed into the shredder, er, suggestion box.


Nope, I asked why you were telling viewers rather than the network. You apparenmtly feel your ideas will be sent to the shredder. However, from the FAQ section:

QUOTE
We care quite a lot, but we're human and, as such, finite. There aren't a lot of hours we can reasonably dedicate to answering all the questions. Although we would like to respond individually to every request and query, we simply can't.


So they formally say they do appreciate feedback. Now if you don't believe them... you're sort of at a dead end. Have you considered though that if they don't follow your suggestions...possibly your suggestions aren't good ones? Not all human beings are experts at everything, and few if any businesses have ever succeeded by taking random suggestions from anonymous strangers. As above, if you could point to some networks that you personally have helped towards greater success because of your ideas, then you might have some grounds to suggest that Syfy should listen to you. But if they actually do shred your feedback.... don't you have your official answer? Isn't it sort of like taking your painting to an expert to authenticate that it's a Van Gogh... they tell you it's a worthless forgery and won't give you a dime for it... and then you still claim it's valuable?

QUOTE
Mega Shark Versus Mega Octopus, Ice Spiders, Boa vs. Python.

Are ANY of those "SciFi?

What is the name of the network?

Get the idea?
..........

so far it appears that "SyFy" has taken to the idea that cheap Horror movies are defacto SciFi.


Here they also have an official answer:

QUOTE
we try to maintain a balance between sci-fi, fantasy and horror in order to present a wide variety of programs in these related genres. We constantly strive to bring our viewers the best in science-fiction, fantasy and horror programming.


They have no requirement to show what one random person thinks is science fiction. They intentionally show a mix of genre entertainment, and always have, since this is what their audience wants. Period. With or without any one person's agreement or approval.

I think you're missing what I was suggesting that you might give them. By tangible data, wasn't asking for more opinions, I was asking for actual facts. For example, a study done by the Harvard School of Mass Communication (if there is such a thing) that showed that cable channels showing only traditional science fiction programming done on expensive budgets generated twice as much profit as showing a mix of genre fare. Or a book detailing trends on this over the last couple of decades. Or newspaper articles about other networks that have done this. Or whatever data you may actually have. Otherwise, a 6-year-old could log in to sugges they show more Smurfs cartoons, and that is just as valuable an amateur opinion.

QUOTE (LordStarFyre1 @ Sep 30 2009, 11:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
So I'll sit here and happily watch the next Syfy Classic "Killer Hampster Versus Monster Gerbil" because you think it's better to be quiet and take it, rather than mention that the Emperor's shvantz is swinging in the breeze.


But again - do you simply want to discuss it among other people who also don't really know what works for networks in pleasing viewers? Or do you want to give suggestions to the network itself?

QUOTE (LordStarFyre1 @ Sep 30 2009, 11:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Seriously, what do the peons know. I mean really. Because the Execs at Syfy got their jobs, that means they, by default, know way more about SciFi than us mere mortals.


No, look above. What is suggested is that if you somehow know more than the people who are the experts, simply explain how and give us and them some proof. A list of networks that have specifically followed you advice and prospered, for example. A list of the awards you've won for science ficton movies or tv shows or books. Or whatever actual data you might have. Otherwise, why would fans want someone suggesting something for a network they enjoy, if that person doesn't know what they're talking about, and just has a personal opinion? Wouldn't that be likely to ruin their favorite network?

Unless that was what you meant to offer. In that case, I think you left out the disclaimer that 1) there's no proof that any of this would be a wise move, 2) there's no actual reason anyone should pay attention to you, and 3) this is simply what you personally want to happen, for your own pleasure, not the well-being of the network or the happines of its fans.

QUOTE (LordStarFyre1 @ Sep 30 2009, 11:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Funny, I never knew Wrestling was Science Fiction.......


Did anyone say it was? As above, the network isn't limited to showing science fiction. Sometimes it shows infomercials. Sometimes it shows documentaries. Sometimes it shows regular commercials. Sometimes it shows Presidential press conferences. Sometimes it shows disaster/emergency special reports. Sometimes it shows science fiction and other genre programming. Once a week it shows wrestling, since twice as many people tune in to see wrestling than did to see reruns of old tv shows and movies that filled that time slot before. And each science fiction show they pair with wrestling sets a new record for the network. But at none of those times does it first check with any one person to make sure that person approves. Make sense?




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